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	<title>Comments on: Measuring</title>
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	<description>i-Flyball</description>
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		<title>By: Linda</title>
		<link>http://www.flyballblog.com/measuring/comment-page-1/#comment-1691</link>
		<dc:creator>Linda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Feb 2011 14:36:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ans12.midphase.com/~flybwor3/measuring/#comment-1691</guid>
		<description>This post and comments are great and I&#039;ve recently heard more talk about this subject, even now, 4 years later in 2011.

Yes, I was in flyball back when apparently &#039;something happened&#039; regarding what has been described to me as a hugely-heated-blow-up among flyballers having to do with measuring height dogs and supposed cheating by a top team or top team(s).  I do not have first-hand knowledge of any of it because I was too pre-occupied trying to help start flyball in a brand new area of the country.  I heard what I considered to be rumors about it, but it didn&#039;t affect me, so I didn&#039;t really pay attention to the topic.

However, I&#039;ve come to realize that it would have been good for me to have paid attention back then.  I don&#039;t know if I would have been privy to the real story and the truth of what was going on, but, I know that hearing more about it would have given me pause enough to look into it better and possibly to have made different decisions about which direction I wanted to take with my flyball endeavors.

I am referring to good sportsmanship in flyball as well as the character of people involved in flyball.  Both of these traits are important to my enjoyment of the sport and affect which people or organization I might choose to be associated with.  What I&#039;ve discovered over the past few years is that (I used to think) all flyball was pretty much the same, just a few different rules here and there.  I no longer have that same naive view.  Flyball &#039;is&#039; different depending on the people and the organization.  If good sportsmanship and quality character are important to you as a flyball participant, I found it makes the choice much simpler which flyball to pursue.  

Wishing everyone the ability to see the difference and the courage to pursue the best flyball course for yourselves.  I sincerely mean that.

Linda</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post and comments are great and I&#8217;ve recently heard more talk about this subject, even now, 4 years later in 2011.</p>
<p>Yes, I was in flyball back when apparently &#8216;something happened&#8217; regarding what has been described to me as a hugely-heated-blow-up among flyballers having to do with measuring height dogs and supposed cheating by a top team or top team(s).  I do not have first-hand knowledge of any of it because I was too pre-occupied trying to help start flyball in a brand new area of the country.  I heard what I considered to be rumors about it, but it didn&#8217;t affect me, so I didn&#8217;t really pay attention to the topic.</p>
<p>However, I&#8217;ve come to realize that it would have been good for me to have paid attention back then.  I don&#8217;t know if I would have been privy to the real story and the truth of what was going on, but, I know that hearing more about it would have given me pause enough to look into it better and possibly to have made different decisions about which direction I wanted to take with my flyball endeavors.</p>
<p>I am referring to good sportsmanship in flyball as well as the character of people involved in flyball.  Both of these traits are important to my enjoyment of the sport and affect which people or organization I might choose to be associated with.  What I&#8217;ve discovered over the past few years is that (I used to think) all flyball was pretty much the same, just a few different rules here and there.  I no longer have that same naive view.  Flyball &#8216;is&#8217; different depending on the people and the organization.  If good sportsmanship and quality character are important to you as a flyball participant, I found it makes the choice much simpler which flyball to pursue.  </p>
<p>Wishing everyone the ability to see the difference and the courage to pursue the best flyball course for yourselves.  I sincerely mean that.</p>
<p>Linda</p>
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		<title>By: Jean</title>
		<link>http://www.flyballblog.com/measuring/comment-page-1/#comment-315</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Aug 2007 16:14:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ans12.midphase.com/~flybwor3/measuring/#comment-315</guid>
		<description>My team plays exclusively in NAFA - this is not a personal choice, there simply are no U-Fli teams in our area so if we want to play, we have to play with NAFA.

I can tell you first hand that we were at a NAFA tournament recently and while there were a total of 30 teams racing... only 7 dogs TOTAL were measured!  Why???  Because the NAFA measuring system is not very accurate.  Once a team gets a low measurement on a dog... they just never measure that dog again and jump that height.  The vast majority of these dogs also do NOT have height cards.  *Trust me... I checked.

It then is up to the opposing team to &#039;call&#039; that team on its height dog.  I&#039;ve played NAFA flyball for 3 years now and I have yet to EVER see a team call another one on their height dog.  Why????  Because most of us are &#039;friends&#039; and that wouldn&#039;t be the neighborly thing to do.  Yet when you truly look at it... isn&#039;t it cheating?  And is it very neighborly for the opposing team to cheat its way to victory?  Not if you ask me.  

For me personally... I&#039;d love to see NAFA implement the U-Fli method of measuring.  The current method is just too subjective.  If a dog is spooked by a particulr judge (say a male judge or a louder voiced judge, etc.)  and stands on its &#039;toes&#039; during measuring... the height could easily be 2 to 3 inches HIGHER than a tournament 2 weeks prior where the dog was relaxed during measuring.  Is this truly fair to the dog, the team, the other dogs on the team that have been practicing week in and week out at the jump height their height dog has been measuring right along?  Not if you ask me.  Asking ANY dog to jump 10&quot; instead of 8&quot; after they&#039;ve spent countless hours practicing at 8&quot; is a recipe for disaster and injury to any dog on that team.

The NAFA method is simply too inaccurate in my personal opinion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My team plays exclusively in NAFA &#8211; this is not a personal choice, there simply are no U-Fli teams in our area so if we want to play, we have to play with NAFA.</p>
<p>I can tell you first hand that we were at a NAFA tournament recently and while there were a total of 30 teams racing&#8230; only 7 dogs TOTAL were measured!  Why???  Because the NAFA measuring system is not very accurate.  Once a team gets a low measurement on a dog&#8230; they just never measure that dog again and jump that height.  The vast majority of these dogs also do NOT have height cards.  *Trust me&#8230; I checked.</p>
<p>It then is up to the opposing team to &#8216;call&#8217; that team on its height dog.  I&#8217;ve played NAFA flyball for 3 years now and I have yet to EVER see a team call another one on their height dog.  Why????  Because most of us are &#8216;friends&#8217; and that wouldn&#8217;t be the neighborly thing to do.  Yet when you truly look at it&#8230; isn&#8217;t it cheating?  And is it very neighborly for the opposing team to cheat its way to victory?  Not if you ask me.  </p>
<p>For me personally&#8230; I&#8217;d love to see NAFA implement the U-Fli method of measuring.  The current method is just too subjective.  If a dog is spooked by a particulr judge (say a male judge or a louder voiced judge, etc.)  and stands on its &#8216;toes&#8217; during measuring&#8230; the height could easily be 2 to 3 inches HIGHER than a tournament 2 weeks prior where the dog was relaxed during measuring.  Is this truly fair to the dog, the team, the other dogs on the team that have been practicing week in and week out at the jump height their height dog has been measuring right along?  Not if you ask me.  Asking ANY dog to jump 10&#8243; instead of 8&#8243; after they&#8217;ve spent countless hours practicing at 8&#8243; is a recipe for disaster and injury to any dog on that team.</p>
<p>The NAFA method is simply too inaccurate in my personal opinion.</p>
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		<title>By: Pete</title>
		<link>http://www.flyballblog.com/measuring/comment-page-1/#comment-97</link>
		<dc:creator>Pete</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jul 2007 22:19:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ans12.midphase.com/~flybwor3/measuring/#comment-97</guid>
		<description>No matter how accurate the measuring system is, you are always going to have some dogs who are right on the bubble.  By that i mean they are so close to the cutoff that 1/16th one way and they jump one height, and 1/16th the other they jump a different height.  Why not try for the lower height if the rules allow it.  I think the important point is that it seems highly unlikely that there would ever be more than a one inch height jump difference in U-FLI (why does U-FLI have an apostrophe?), differences of 2 and even 3 inches have been seen using the NAFA system.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No matter how accurate the measuring system is, you are always going to have some dogs who are right on the bubble.  By that i mean they are so close to the cutoff that 1/16th one way and they jump one height, and 1/16th the other they jump a different height.  Why not try for the lower height if the rules allow it.  I think the important point is that it seems highly unlikely that there would ever be more than a one inch height jump difference in U-FLI (why does U-FLI have an apostrophe?), differences of 2 and even 3 inches have been seen using the NAFA system.</p>
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		<title>By: Larry</title>
		<link>http://www.flyballblog.com/measuring/comment-page-1/#comment-6</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jul 2007 04:16:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ans12.midphase.com/~flybwor3/measuring/#comment-6</guid>
		<description>Your first question sounds like a hypothetical question to me since you don’t have firsthand knowledge of this. Have you ever been to a U-FLI tournament? Has your dog ever been measured for a U-FLI tournament? I can’t answer your second question since I am in no way affiliated with either U-FLI or NAFA.

I tried to look at this as objectively as I could and I’m not going to get into the habit of defending my post but in this case I thought that I should. I have attended both NAFA and U-FLI tournaments. My dogs have been measured for both NAFA and U-FLI tournaments. To me it doesn’t take a genius to figure out which is a more accurate method of measurement.

Larry
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your first question sounds like a hypothetical question to me since you don’t have firsthand knowledge of this. Have you ever been to a U-FLI tournament? Has your dog ever been measured for a U-FLI tournament? I can’t answer your second question since I am in no way affiliated with either U-FLI or NAFA.</p>
<p>I tried to look at this as objectively as I could and I’m not going to get into the habit of defending my post but in this case I thought that I should. I have attended both NAFA and U-FLI tournaments. My dogs have been measured for both NAFA and U-FLI tournaments. To me it doesn’t take a genius to figure out which is a more accurate method of measurement.</p>
<p>Larry</p>
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		<title>By: Christine VanWert</title>
		<link>http://www.flyballblog.com/measuring/comment-page-1/#comment-3</link>
		<dc:creator>Christine VanWert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jul 2007 22:20:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ans12.midphase.com/~flybwor3/measuring/#comment-3</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&gt;There is a more accurate method of measuring in use by United Flyball League International (U-FLI). This method is so accurate that the dog only needs to be measured once. This measurement is then recorded in the U-FLI database and the dog never has to be measured again, and there is no need for a height card.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I have one question that I would really like to have an &quot;objective&quot; answer for. If it is true that this method is so &quot;objective&quot; and &quot;accurate&quot;, Why? is it that a friend of mine was encouraged by a U-FLI shareholder to have her dog measured at each and every U-FLI tournament she participates in until she could get the one lowest possible measurement that she wants? In other words, she could measure 5, 10 or even 100 times and if only one judge measures her dog so that it jumps lower than it ever has before, THAT ONE MEASURE now becomes that dog&#039;s jump height forever. If that can happen, just how &quot;accurate&quot; can you claim the U-FLI method to be?&lt;br /&gt;
....and, the second thing I&#039;m curious about is this: If the judge that measures a dog in U-FLI and finds that dog should be jumping shorter than it did previously by other judges, if that judge is not applying that method correctly according to U-FLI&#039;s rules, what recourse do U-FLI competitors have to make that judge follow U-FLI&#039;s rules? Can U-FLI revoke that dog&#039;s &quot;inaccurate&quot; measure?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;There is a more accurate method of measuring in use by United Flyball League International (U-FLI). This method is so accurate that the dog only needs to be measured once. This measurement is then recorded in the U-FLI database and the dog never has to be measured again, and there is no need for a height card.</p>
<p>I have one question that I would really like to have an &#8220;objective&#8221; answer for. If it is true that this method is so &#8220;objective&#8221; and &#8220;accurate&#8221;, Why? is it that a friend of mine was encouraged by a U-FLI shareholder to have her dog measured at each and every U-FLI tournament she participates in until she could get the one lowest possible measurement that she wants? In other words, she could measure 5, 10 or even 100 times and if only one judge measures her dog so that it jumps lower than it ever has before, THAT ONE MEASURE now becomes that dog&#8217;s jump height forever. If that can happen, just how &#8220;accurate&#8221; can you claim the U-FLI method to be?<br />
&#8230;.and, the second thing I&#8217;m curious about is this: If the judge that measures a dog in U-FLI and finds that dog should be jumping shorter than it did previously by other judges, if that judge is not applying that method correctly according to U-FLI&#8217;s rules, what recourse do U-FLI competitors have to make that judge follow U-FLI&#8217;s rules? Can U-FLI revoke that dog&#8217;s &#8220;inaccurate&#8221; measure?</p>
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